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gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Discuss the Submerged World of GoPro. NO Camera issues Please.

Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby kuris » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:23 pm

i tried the render setting on 1080 30fps, everything get better. thank you very much.

fortunately, i just took few 4K, the rest mainly 2.7K. actually i just want to try the 4K function this time, i never try since i bought hero4 silver 2 years ago.
i mounted gopro on the housing of my camera. took pictures and video together. and my camera just can make 1080p 60fps, so when i tried to make all footage together, became a problem this time. also i took some footage by a DJI Mavic 4K 24p during this liveaboard trip. i wanted to make a trip video record for my friend who i made on vessel. finally, i found many problem when editing all the footage together. even i'm using a I7 CPU(few years ago model), still very hard to edit and preview. i can just turn down the preview resolution while editing the footage.

however, is that mean that is no problem when downscale the fps,e.g. 60fps back to 30fps or lower; but serious problem when upscale the fps like 15 to 30 or above? when i downscale the fps, looks everything the same by watching by eyes.

Anyway , thank you very much for your suggestion.
thank you SP introduce SRP filter to me, this is really great filter.
kuris
 
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby mikerb » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:12 am

...downscale fps is simple...it just skips frames. Upscale fps is a different issue. In essence the fps used in a render is designed to match the capability of the media player that will play the video. Little point rendering at 60 fps if the video codec used for your player is set to 30fps. If however ( as is increasingly the case) the video player can play 60 fps ( ie genuinely not by downscaling it) then rendering at 60 fps is worthwhile. In a VLE the codec will have to duplicate frames in order to convert from 30 to 60 etc. The issue with your 4k footage is more to do with the very high resolution and the bit rate required to translate/convert it by your codec. As I said before I can see no real benefit in using 4k unless lighting conditions are perfect. In your case with a Hero 4, being restricted to 15fps makes it ( in my book) worse than useless. You would likely get far better real world resolution at 2.7k or 1080. Your DJI 4k 24p footage is even more problematic. A vle can at least cope with a simple mathematical fps conversion....30 to 60 for example. Converting from 24 to 30 is complex. If possible I would avoid that setting on your DJI The only real reason to use 24fps is to match output from a film camera on the same render.....but you would also need to be using protune so that the grading could be made to match.
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby suryaprihadi » Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:20 am

Hi Kuris,

Some advice for you, for underwater video.

Often diving takes place on a slope and not flat terrain.
Slope diving makes sunlight position varies depending on time and slope position in respect to the sun.

Backlight often occurs and you dont realize it while shooting, but during edit you will have hardtime to get proper color or color fidelity.

Here is a video footage taken by my friend, so i can show you some screen capture, but I cant upload a video which is not mine.
This is using Black4 at 4K and using SRP Cyan Filter for Black5, the plastic one.
WB is set at NATIVE
Color is GoPro Color ( not FLAT ).

Avoid shooting like this : Where the sun is a bright background, and you actually wants to show scenery and not silhoutte
.
a1 - no 1 -  lots of sun behind as background.JPG

.
a1 - no 2 - lots of sun behind as background.JPG

.

This kind of scene as two above is tough to color correct and get good color.
What my friend should have done in this case is actually to hoover a bit higher and keep the sun away from entering the field of view, if he really wants to capture the scenery....better yet, get the sun behind him.


Here is an example of a better lightning angle
.
a2- no 1.JPG

.
a2- no 2.JPG



Now I show you the difference....
a4.JPG

The left image where I give green arrow to the right image, is actually corals having the same color.
AA. Left image is much shallower depth than right side image.
BB. Left image is also less distant of light to travel from sea surface to object and then to camera sensor.
By color loss vs depth/distance, AA + BB should give right side image pooper color fidelity, but no, right image has better color due to the no
backlight interference from the sun.


Continue..........
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby suryaprihadi » Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:36 am

This is approx 15-20 meters deep.
If it werent for the SRP Cyan filter, even with Protune it will be difficult to bring the color back...

.
a3 - no 1.JPG


The water viz for this video is easy 15 meters...which is not bad.
In 4K video, I can actually read the DiveMaster tank serial numbers :mrgreen:
Dive Master on purpose uses two different colored fins, so that people can ID him with ease.
.

The below two images is about skin tone.
The Dive Master and the dive guest
a3 - no 2.JPG

.
a3 - no 3.JPG



The Dive Master is a dark skin guy and the guest diver is a fair skin guy.

So this video shows, SRP Cyan color assist with Protune is indeed good and not over saturated and how sunlight angle destroy an image.
So do use Protune at WB native and GoPro Color , no need Flat color which may result in much more work :mrgreen: .

One note : regardles how good a 4K video is, if the housing we use is a flat lens, the last 15% of the video edges left and right will always be soft.
There is no cheap solution for this, this is given. A suitable dome lens will be expensive and only 1 housing I know of has such design and its not for Black5, it is for Hero4 series.

One day if I have time, I will use my Nikon D800 big dome and hide a Black5 inside my Nauticam Nikon D800 housing and see what I get :lol:
However dome size has special calculation towards the lens of the camera being used to get the least soft-ness on edges, it is not as simple as all dome will do. It is about correcting for light mislalignment specific to the hardware used.

Safe diving.... and have fun with UW video.

SP
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.
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby kuris » Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:35 pm

hello SP,

thank you very much for your information.

actually i tried your method to take video this time. but i cannot do what i want sometimes.
for example, i dived in Maldives this time, most of the dive sites are very strong current, normally we stay at the entrance of the channel, divers need to use a reef hook in specific locations, we don't have choice to choose a good location which is the best position from sun, unless the creatures coming from a good direction. (not always happen).

this is the first time for me to use SRP filter since i bought it 9 month ago, i found the best result of SRP should be between 10-20M, when over 20M, the color loose still happen, even I'm setting WB Native, still difficult to recover in Vegas pro.

Finally, i have a question of 4K rendering. because of the fps are not the same, i will try to render to 4k(play on 4k TV directly), 2.7k and 1080p separately. is it just need to change the bitrate range? also, u mentioned about i need to disable the "resample" in property of file. what is the "re-sample"? what is the difference of "smart resample" and "force resample"? when i need to disable and when i should use smart resample?

thank you very much.
kuris
 
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby suryaprihadi » Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:48 pm

Hi K,

Yes if location has current, video is not important as safety must come first.
Up to 20 meters for a color correction filter is as good as you get in high viz water.

See this :
http://www.divephotoguide.com/underwate ... e-starter/

Image



.
This is an interesting test, I am amazed at pink actually able to do that well. I have assumed pink would do as bad as red.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAJjdA6b4Ts


No wonder the lady diver pink fin hold its color well at depth.
However remember that this test colors are very close to the camera and being held still and occupy 80% of entire FOV, so I assume the Auto
WB is holding on decently well.


This is another test but too bad in California where the water is not offshore bluewater like Maldives but more greenish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwRai7Y2RiQ
Underwater Macbeth Color Checker



Another murky water test, but good to see
Testing Light and Colour Underwater
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MM_RwdUi30Q


.
The theory is simple, you can not get something from nothing.
When diving past 20+ meters and the colored object is say 3-5 meters away from you, most non blue-green colors are gone, so you cant get something out of nothing. Only video lights can bring back the colors. If video is the intention of the dive, stay at 10 meters max in good viz water.

The best UW video for color stability and color fidelity is actually a night dive and get close to the reef and use a 90 CRI LED light.
Today we dont use Xenon or halogen video lights anymore...too much power consumption with little lumens.
If you see our cave dive member here, his cave dive video is awesome, but cave does not have much color like a tropical reef would, but its very stable color and exposure he is getting.


You wrote :
also, u mentioned about i need to disable the "resample" in property of file. what is the "re-sample"? what is the difference of "smart resample" and "force resample"? when i need to disable and when i should use smart resample?
I dont mix FPS, so I disabled smart resample. Chief Rambo taught me. :mrgreen: Me is not very knowledgeable on using NLE ( editor ), I know a bit just to not screw up.

.
Here is for your learning on smart resample, which is needed when you mix FPS.
Sony Vegas Pro 12 - What is Smart Resample?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgdXZECRYgg



YouTube has almost all the answers relating to Vegas Pro :idea:

Dive Safe...
.
I am a Forum Sponsor not because I sell stuff.
I owe my knowledge to this forum and I would like to do some payback.
.
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Re: gopro hero 4 rendering problem

Postby kuris » Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:09 pm

finally, i made a better output on 1080 30fps.
i have another question, when i mix different footage together, what should i set the property at the beginning of the project?
e.g. the same include 4k, 2.7k, 1080, what resolution and fps i should be set at the project beginning? or doesn't matter, just set whatever i want then choose the resolution & fps in the rendering option?
kuris
 
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